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Ubuntu Linux [is it] for [any] Human Beings أرسل من قبل foaad في الأحد, 2006/04/02 - 1:17am.
Following the discussion on Linux ease of use I promised to try out Ubuntu -supposedly the simplest and easiest Linux distro.
Installation:I know that we can't count installation complexity if we're talking about average user point of view because installing an OS can't be easy or simple unless you're welling to let the OS do what ever it wants with you're hard disk. But Linux distros especially must have a solid installation system -that is of course because you can't get Linux preinstalled on a new PC and most of Linux users want to maintain their previous OS and data.
MUI:The MUI in Ubuntu is quite questionable (at least in Arabic). (5)Translation of UI is far away from completion and (6)the desktop isn't right-to-left if you choose a right-to-left language.
Settings and configuration:During installation you're asked to specify the screen resolution you want to use unfortunately you can't specify the refresh rate and -of course- you can't choose the monitor model or graphics card model.
Features:When you hit [Print Screen] key a dialog with a thumbnail pops and provide you the opportunity to save the image but (11)the image itself isn't stored in the clipboard so you can't use it in other applications unless you save it first. And (12)another irritating thing about [Print Screen] key is that it doesn't work some times, like if there is a menu visible (a context menu for example) this seriously affects the usability of this functionality.
Bugs:I think that I have stumbled upon some bugs 7 - 9 - 12
Conclusion:At the end of this installation I found my self with a completely unusable OS that's because I can't see files on other Partitions9 and at a 60 Hz refresh rate I can't stare at the monitor for too long8 and I can't connect to the Internet. ( معلوماتية )
Ubuntu should arabize apps for us, bad Ubuntu bad!
You mean that an Arabic user should get the source code arabize it recompile it and then install it?!
Seriously, don't you think it's easiler this way?
But can't I have my cake and eat it too! And how I'm supposed to take a snapshot of the system menu?!
You didn't try the Synaptic package manager, did you? (Just for example)
What do you mean? is there some packages that will solve some of the problems that I had?
I wonder how good is Windows at mounting Linux partitions?
But other distros are really good at mounting Windows partitions why Ubuntu isn't?!BTW Windows can afford to neglect other file systems Linux can't.
enjoy Windows
I can't, because it's no good but I still haven't found a better choice. 
 You just prove the point I suggested in the other thread foaad, you still insist on that a piece of s/w is not usable if you cannot use it the way you use Windows and if you cannot set it up the way you set up Winodws and if your Winodws knowledge doesn't allow you to use it. That's a shame. Expect a generic installation to auto-mount other partitions and set up internet connection for you? Does any of Windows installations do that? How many users new to Windows can set it up successfully? Only terminology you use throughout the entry suggests that you don't have enough information about the very basics of Linux and Unices. I'm afraid you cannot pretend to be smart about anything if you don't have sufficient knowledge about its basics, particularly writing reviews evaluating something as complex as an operating system.
I'm in the very heart of the context, the entire entry can be summarized as "I'm a Windows user and I want to install an all different system that I cannot administer and can use only a little with no troubles whatsoever. I don't succeed, therefore, this system is bad. Newcomers stay away, this ain't a thing to tackle." Eh? I just don't know what it takes to get through you that these are different systems and you cannot assume to be able to do anything particlularly administrative tasks on Unices before you are familiar with some basics. I asked you about how many computer users can install Windows out of the blue and you jumped over it and I can understand why. If indeed everyone was able to install Windows there wouldn't be coutnless parasites in the market making money out of wiping disks and installing Windows.
 Well...  All of these are very common problems, in all fairness. I can still remember them, because I'm new to Linux/FreeBSD, but I think أيمن and strontium90 don't think of them as serious because they have experience with the system, and can fix such issues easily. In fact, I'm nowdays struggling with some of them on Gentoo. These are legitimate complaints. Some of the issues are with Ubuntu itself, because some other distros don't have them. Suse, for instance autodetects and automounts Windows partitions under "/windows". As for refresh rate and resolution, you can fix that (in Suse, at least), by running a graphical configuration program called SAX (Suse Advanced X configuration). I'm not sure about other distros, but perhaps you need to edit some configuration file ... As for Arabic, you can edit and enter text in it, but many apps are untranslated ... The broken text in the screenshot is something I've never seen on Suse. Internet configuration is simple in Suse; with yast, you configured the modem, the proxy, and whatever else through a lovely graphical interface. The thing about getting screenshots with printscreen is new to me. Perhaps you have some extra program installed by default? I used to go to the kde menu, choose utilities, and Ksnapshot, which is a little program that lets you take snapshots of the screen (even at timed intervals). In fact, this brings back memories ... By the way, a quick question about Gentoo, do you need to have an active internet connection ? I've been trying to find a place where one could download packages, but in vain. I haven't been able to get the modem to work under Gentoo yet, and anyway it's just a modem, too slow to download anything meaningful. We might go on discussing this later... But the most imprtant thing is : Allow me to congratulate you, foaad  Welcome to Linux 
Did you read the 2nd and 4th points?!
Yesterday I've installed Linspire Five-O (which I've downloaded some times ago through a limited time offer) and the installation process was more simpler that Ubutnu's and it automatically mounted my NTFS partitions and I was able to configure a modem Internet connection and I was able to set refresh rate to 85 Hz. This distro can be recommended to newcomers (it also provide narrated tutorials) unfortunately it's not free (free of charge that is). But -of course- there was a problem (may be a hardware compatibility issue) the whole systems hangs for about tenth of a second every two seconds you'll notice the cursor stops and moves if you're moving it and the same goes for the sound when plying a sound file. Unfortunately now I lost the Linux partition; I was playing with boot loaders and MBR tools until I successfully managed to corrupt the partition table and spent all night long trying to recover partitions I was able to recover the three Windows partitions and I sacrificed the Linux partition. I said that the installation process in Linux is far more important than in Windows for obvious reasons. And I also said that no average user can install an OS these days unless he wants to install it on a blank hard disk.
Thanks. But I'm not a Linux user yet.
May be I'll try SUSE later... Allow me to congratulate you, foaad Don't you see he's running away screaming.. ?! Welcome to Linux  As for refresh rate and resolution, you can fix that (in Suse, at least), by running a graphical configuration program called SAX (Suse Advanced X configuration). I'm not sure about other distros, but perhaps you need to edit some configuration file ... No it's not that "difficult". In KDE you just right click the desktop and set the refresh rate in display options. Fooad must love this. I said that the installation process in Linux is far more important than in Windows for obvious reasons. Why? Isn't Windows an operating system too that's supposed to control the same resources as any other operating system? And I also said that no average user can install an OS these days unless he wants to install it on a blank hard disk. Do you imply that if the disk is blank the installation process will be easier and in the reach of an average user? Did you read the 2nd and 4th points?! Yes of course, what the heck if the interface arabization is buggy? Is it that important? Points to consider about OS installers I've seen so far (FreeBSD syainstall and Windows 2000 and XP): - Winodws installers overwrite your MBR without asking you, FreeBSD sysinstall does ask you. - Windows installers (2000 and XP) don't tell you what you'll end up having on your disk, FreeBSD sysinstall presents you with complete optionsets of what to install and what not to, furthermore, it offers installation profiles to avoid tedious manual selection; kernel developer, X developer, desktop user, everything, etc. - Windows installers present incomplete network setup options, whereas FreeBSD sysinstall allows you to set up and configure FTP, PPP/SLIP, NFS, ethernet (network level), SSH etc. - Windows installers present incomplete network setup options, whereas FreeBSD sysinstall allows you to set up and configure FTP, PPP/SLIP, NFS, ethernet (network level), SSH etc. - Windows installers don't automount or even present you with options to mount other partitions, SuSE GNU/Linux installer does that as ahnaqsh mentioned. It must be mentioned that X configuration procedures were removed from sysinstall strating from FreeBSD 5.3 and diverted to a separate app that is usually run after sysinstall to set up video display and monitor settings (including refresh rate of course) and to select desktop environment and window manager to meet each user's preference.
Why do you keep asking about the same things? I don't like to repeat my self.
Linux installation is more important because it's the only OS that you can't get pre-installed on a PC. The installation process of an OS can be realy simple if you chose to let the OS autoaticly partion your HD for example Linspire installation would be like this: Next->Next->Next->Finish.
Why do you keep asking about the same things? I don't like to repeat my self. Linux installation is more important because it's the only OS that you can't get pre-installed on a PC. WOW I didn't know that there are companies who ship PCs with FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD or GNU/Hurd preinstalled to the cusromers' liking!
The installation process of an OS can be realy simple if you chose to let the OS autoaticly partion your HD for example Linspire installation would be like this: Next->Next->Next->Finish.
Yes of course, if you feel that it is the OS who uses your computer and not the other way around.
 You mean that an Arabic user should get the source code arabize it recompile it and then install it?!
No, the process is as easy as using a text editor, the problem is that no one is willing to contribute, I contributed to the Gnome localization project for a while, it was complete at some point and received some marketing efforts, but people here simply lack the mentality of contributing without getting something in return, or how else do you explain that l10n projects for very unpopular languages are more successful that Arabic? Later Gnome grew larger than what a handful of people could handle... But can't I have my cake and eat it too! And how I'm supposed to take a snapshot of the system menu?!
If you took some time to experiment or search the web, you'd find that you could take screenshots of menus using The Gimp: File > Acquire > Screenshot, this one is as easy as MS Paint, but shorter, by the way, did you find out how to use MS Paint to take a screenshot on your own and on the first day you used Windows? I seriously doubt anyone did. What do you mean? is there some packages that will solve some of the problems that I had?
No, but I think that Synaptic is an innovation over searching the web for Windows apps, under Ubuntu you have a unified and secure way for installing apps. Regarding the fonts problem, instead of whining about it, I'd do something productive and report the bug, the solution is as simple as choosing another font at Prefs > Font, you know, the devs most likely don't know Arabic, if you're not willing to submit a bug report, let me know and I'll do it myself. But other distros are really good at mounting Windows partitions why Ubuntu isn't?!
BTW Windows can afford to neglect other file systems Linux can't. In time it will, remember that Linux kernel devs don't have any specs to implement NTFS support, this is why it's crippled in many distros. In fact, this brings back memories ... By the way, a quick question about Gentoo, do you need to have an active internet connection ? I've been trying to find a place where one could download packages, but in vain. I haven't been able to get the modem to work under Gentoo yet, and anyway it's just a modem, too slow to download anything meaningful.
You can download packages elsewhere and drop them into /usr/portage/distfiles, further details: Regarding the fonts problem, instead of whining about it, I'd do something productive and report the bug, the solution is as simple as choosing another font at Prefs > Font, you know, the devs most likely don't know Arabic, if you're not willing to submit a bug report, let me know and I'll do it myself.
I don't think it's a bug it's more like an illogical behaviourthe installer offered to download some packages for Arabic support choosing not to download will not revert the UI language back to default and will result in a funny looking "Arabic" UI and now you have to use this hard to read UI to revert the UI language back to English.
I don't think it's a bug it's more like an illogical behaviour
Ehm, what's an "illogical behavior"? Characters aren't joined because a font that doesn't support that is used, this *is* a bug.
If you want to report it go ahead.
But I have to remind you AGAIN: the installer offered to download some packages for Arabic support choosing not to download will ...
And how is this not a bug? A minor one I know, but you are already complaining about it in your blog entry!
It's either not worth reporting => Not worth criticizing, or the opposite.
I don't call every problem in a software a bug
But you can call it a bug if you want. And I don't report bugs cuz I don't like to work as a tester for anyone. But if you're going to report it please also report (7), (9), (12) and (13).
I don't call every problem in a software a bug But you can call it a bug if you want. And I don't report bugs cuz I don't like to work as a tester for anyone. But if you're going to report it please also report (7), (9), (12) and (13). To each his own, but you do realize that Ubuntu devs are volunteers don't you? And reporting bugs is a way to help them, the mentality of OSS is different from closed source software.
And Windows users have always been testers for MS By the way Ubuntu's first bug has nothing to do with software. You can download packages elsewhere and drop them into /usr/portage/distfiles, further details: http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/faq.xml#manualdownload Thanks for the info
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Just look at this step-by-step guide for installing Xgl on SUSE 10.1 (keep in mind that Xgl is included in SUSE 10.1 so it's not like hacking the system or anything).
I think I'll rest my case Windows is way too easier than Linux (easier doesn't mean better). IMHO there are two thing to-do to make Linux easier and probably better than Windows: 1-Eliminate redundancy (1 distro, 1 X-Server, 1 Window manager, etc...) 2-Software installation should be through a stand alone executable that does all the work for you not though a centralized tool. Explaining the previous two points could take pages but if you really think about it you'll find them valid points. 1-Eliminate redundancy (1 distro, 1 X-Server, 1 Window manager, etc...) You consider having freedom of choice among many window managers redundancy? I wrote a lengthy response which got eaten up when seamonkey crashed on me for some reason ... The second point is interesting; but it really works best on Windows, which has big (really big) application packages, and you're unlikely to install that many apps on the system. Unix has many small apps that are inter-dependent, and if you have hundreds of them on the system it becomes a bad idea to give each an installer, and you will want a program that can install many at a time and upgrade them as well, hence the package manager.
The second point is interesting; but it really works best on Windows, which has big (really big) application packages, and you're unlikely to install that many apps on the system. Unix has many small apps that are inter-dependent, and if you have hundreds of them on the system it becomes a bad idea to give each an installer, and you will want a program that can install many at a time and upgrade them as well, hence the package manager. You shouldn't ovelook the BSD ports system. This framework has been proven on *BSD systems and Gentoo GNU/Linux to be able to keep thousands of programs with a plethora of dependencies in sync making installing and deinstalling a breeze. if you didn't like ubuntu , try kubuntu I'm trying to download kubuntu these days, it seems like it's one of the best distros around. Does anyone know if it's available at المستقبل or anywhere else so that I don't have to download the whole thing?
I'm trying to download kubuntu these days, it seems like it's one of the best distros around. Does anyone know if it's available at المستقبل or anywhere else so that I don't have to download the whole thing? I'll download it for you. The fine print: I won't be responsible for any damage this distro or any other distro will do to you or your PC.
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This is ridiculous. The philosophy of Unix from day one has been about presenting multiple options and to let people decide which to use and which to leave. On the other hand, imposing policies is a Microsoft Windows strategy, so essentially what you're singing is over and again the same song; Linux must look and feel like Windows for it to be cool. It won't, and it will never be because it isn't Windows and cannot be Windows. 
© 2004-2008 CSC-SY
Ubuntu should arabize apps for us, bad Ubuntu bad!
And I couldn't really find anything new or interesting in Ubuntu.
OMG!!111 It works different from Windows, thus it sucks!!111~
Seriously, don't you think it's easiler this way? When the average user is asked to do a printscreen, which one is easier, clicking save, or going to Start > Programs > Accessories > Paint > Edit > Paste > Save As > OK?
You didn't try the Synaptic package manager, did you? (Just for example)
I wonder how good is Windows at mounting Linux partitions?
I won't waste your time or mine any more, to each his own, enjoy Windows